THANKS for stopping by, I do my best to acknowledge when someone leaves a comment,you do not have to be a member here & everyone is welcome. Ps: This site is monitored but not actively posting on a regular basis. Mostly these are stories & some photos saved from a defunct site known as Verdun Connections which was on MSN Groups initially then on a social network called Multiply.
62 comments:
Welcome Redwing3235 Why not tell us some stories, or pics, of the Pav as you remember it. Many of us here would really enjoy hearing. Cheers.
what years did you hang around the pav?
Margo
Hi redwing and all members,
I'd like to know if I was the only teenage girl who lived in Verdun, high
school years 54-58 who was forbidden to go to the Pav because of all those
black leather jacket motorcycle riders.
My poor Dad must be rolling over in his grave. Not only is his son-in-law a
biker, leather jacket, chaps and all but so is his son.
Ruth
I was another one of those girls who was forbidden to hang around the pav or my father would kill me. My years in highschool were '57 - '61.
Oddly enough Junebug,......those were usually my marks in HighSchool 57-61 hahahahahahah hf&rv
Just because you couldn't be there then ,.doesn't mean you can't be there Now ..........................See .................hahahaha HF&RV
yes, the great days at the Pav. I remember one summer when a couple of us had canoes and a tent. We set up the tent on Nun's island and lived there for the summer. the only time our parents seen us was when we ran out of food (cans of beans were a prefered menu) and had to go home for more. We played a lot of cards and drank a little. I only remember a couple of the fellows, (Frank McCrory, John Tahamont John Mulolly) there were others I just don't remember their names. Can anyone out there help we on this?? Bob Allen
hi Bob (sailorboy68)............Indeed the Pav was a destination spot for us all,...as we got old enough to go there,......but being told not to go there only added to the mystique.........hahahaha That old juke box pounded out tunes and the old wooden floor creaked and was by no means level,.......but talk about character,.....that place had it,........... Here's an old shot of some outdoor dance in the early 60's,.......as close as some were allowed to get to the Pav,.........We still are awauting a real good picture of the old Pav,.......we've got several 'almost' good enough shots,.....but not the real thing yet... ................................
Where was the "Pav"? There is some kind of dance area now somewhere along the boardwalk (maybe near the Nat?)
just love old pictures of Verdun..yes..true our
parents told us not to go there..i had 7 sisters they
could not get there fast enough.. ha ha
john
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just love old pictures of Verdun..yes..true our
parents told us not to go there..i had 7 sisters they
could not get there fast enough.. ha ha
john
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I remember a Tahamont...wasn't he an aboriganl..my brother may have hung around him ,
As I recall the Pavillion Dance Hall was around Second and LasSalle but the bandshell at Woodland was often mistakenly called 'The Pav'. I remember kids saying there's a movie at the pav, but they actually meant Wpoodland Park. I never spent any time at the Pav dances as my wife to be preferred the '79th Armory Battery' dances which later became the Point Boys Club and now is the YMCA. It was risky there if they found out you were from Verdun. Maybe someone can straighten me out on the History. Ed
Hi Ed ,.....the wooden building immediately behind the Bandshell ,Was the Pav,.without a doubt ,....a few generations would buy salmai sandwhiches & french fries from there,..they had a wooden floor in there that ,took on it's own undulating shape over the years,.....Their Juke Box,..played many a hit for the kids of each generation,..Sadly coming to an end somewhere around 68 roughly,.......(the owners of the day had gotten tired of break -ins ,and just general pains in the rear,........but it's history will live on as a meeting place for many over the years,....... i have not come across a very 'clear cut picture' of this old treasure (but I will,one day),.......but We have posted a few of 'very near' shots of the old building,...it was part of the old VerdunTennis Club (of which I have posted pictures of),....but the actual PAV remains somewhat illususive,..........I will continue to try to find a 'dedicated shot of this old landmark' As for kids saying they saw a movie (or were going to a movie) at the PAV,....I think you are right they really meant the Woodland Bandshell,........but it was probably 'way cooler' to say I went to the PAV last night,....than the movie............hahahahaha
Actually you are both right and both wrong........to a degree.
The actual first Pavillion is pictured here ....it was at the corner of Church Ave......and LaSalle Blvd........then It was moved to the corner of 2nd Ave and LaSalle , aproximately . It then became the KNIGHT's OF COLUMBUS HALL , I believe...Also there was the "Anglo's PAV " which as Les described it was located at the corner of Woodland and LaSalle on the River side .....
joey
Will there be Pictures of the fabled " ANGLO PAV " in my
book ? You will have to wait ......
Soon you will be pleasantly surprised .......
joey
In the 70's, the Knight's of Columbus Hall was a manse (not the one pictured in Joey's post) on the river side of LaSalle Blvd between Willibrord and Rielle. They rented the hall out for wedding receptions.
This message has been deleted by the author.
Let me clarify....the picture that I posted was an image of the original PAVILLION which was in existance predateing the charter of the city of VERDUN.......according to official sources .
I did not mean to have people get the impression that the building was moved to a new location.......
When I said that the building was moved I was refering to the functional aspects of the facility.......K of C and dances.
And yes Maggi you are correct in your description of the
location .....you have refreshed my memory.....thanks
I didn't mean to cause any confusion.......even though it is easy to do :)
And sometimes entertaining : )
joey
Here is an interesting old memory......
wrong season but what the heck......eh ?
joey
SEMANTICS ! Maggi thank you for reminding me of this
very important concept.....
In our previous discussion concerning the relocation of the
PAVILLION.......to further clarify , I was refering to the LEGAL
FICTION that moved ......the LEGAL ENTITY was the K of C ,
Knights of Columbus PAVILLION....
I've included a picture of an old library at the corner of Church and Verdun Ave.....where at the time the Bank moved and the Library took it's place......yet the building remained in the same place .
Verdun sense of humour ? You decide :)
joey
All very interesting pics Joey,......but I would think that the 'PAV' as it was known ,and warned about by parents "not to go there" was the one at Woodland (behind or beside the old Bandshell),,,,,,,,,,,,deppending 'how you look at it' hahahahahaha..............VerdunHumour ........you decide: BTW that picture of the bank ,really shows up the old Dominion Store on Church Ave.......(and the rest of the Dominion sign on the rear/side of the building) We've posted this pic ,before,.but I think this is one of the most clear copies,so far: Don't forget to remind us when your book comes out,...I would suspect it will be a must have...................
to me the PAV was a building on the bottom of woodland
street..parents did not allow us to go there but we
all did...it was not a bad place..Think they use to
have dances around there..
john
Speaking of Woodland Park. Wasn't there a football league played at the old 'cement downs'?
The Pav Great memories of that wooden built dance hall at the corner of Woodland and Lasalle between the bandshell and the tenis courts. The band leader was named David pronounced in French. It was a great hangout for the Zoot Zuiters during the war years until the navy retliated one night for a previous attack on a few sailors.As teenagers at the time we saw one heck of a brawl.Woodland park had two football leagues ,Midget and Juvenile. We hoped for rain to soften up the so called cement downs. Great memories of 25 years in Verdun
There was a John and a Winston Tahamont. My brother hung around with John Margo
Did you play football during the late 40's Margo
Yes, for New York Fashions midget team
KW mentions the Zoot Suit/Navy brawl at the Pav. It was June 2, 1944. Zoot suits had beat up a Navy man who was walking On Dorchester with his girlfriend. The Navy retaliated In Verdun by stripping the Zoots of their clothes and burning them. They sent the women and anyone not wearing a Zoot away. They then stripped and beat 27 men and 1 woman who was wearing a Zoot. It was pretty much played down because 2 days later the Normandy invasion started. A Verdun investigation led by Mayor Wilson and Rev. Reid of St.John the Divine Church on Moffat opposed Mtl Police who blamed the Navy. Rev, Reid said that if healthy young men want to hassle the men who are fighting for our freedom they deserve whatever they get. Although it was quickly forgotten because of the war, it left a bad taste in the mouth of parents. So now you know why you had to tell your parents you were going a church dance. Ed
My brother-in-law, Bob Thompson played for Antecol's at the old cement downs. Alan Costigan and Bob Geary played there as well. I was in the same class as Alan, you couldn't find a more likeable guy. Always smiling. Ed
More on the Zoot Suit Riots : The Montreal and Verdun Zoot-Suit disturbances of June 1944: language conflict, a problem of civil-military relations or youthful over-exuberance? Serge Marc Durflinger Historian
Historical Research and Exhibit Development
Canadian War Museum The zoot-suiters barricaded themselves within the Dance Hall while the young sailors tore up concrete park benches which they used as battering rams to clear a way into the building...They ordered all girls off the premises, with the exception of two who were wearing the feminine equivalent of a zoot suit, and they also expelled all young men who were not zoot-suiters. They then proceeded to tear off the clothes of the luckless zoot-suiters, including the two young women who were caught in the naval net. Some [zoot-suiters] climbed to the rafters of the building but were soon pulled from their perches...and many were bruised and exhibited black eyes.8 The brawling lasted more than an hour and was over by about 11 p.m. The Montreal Star referred to the fighting in Verdun as "vicious" while La Presse noted that "les bagarres ont pris des proportions graves à Verdun".9 By 2:30 a.m. on Sunday the fighting in Montreal had ended and control of the city streets reverted to the shore patrolmen and the police. Dozens of zooters, sailors, bystanders and Montreal and Verdun policemen had been injured and over 40 people arrested, 37 of them sailors. Fighting between zooters and sailors, airmen and soldiers continued sporadically until June 7, although by this date zoot suits had become a rare sight on the streets of Montreal. The Montreal Star described the violence as the "servicemen's private war on zoot-suiters".10 The Gazette concurred, calling the disturbances an "island-wide armed forces campaign against zoot-suiters". The "Zoot-suit Riots" were front page news in the English-language press until June 6, when they were superseded by news of more serious fighting in Normandy. But explanations, recriminations and blame for the fighting were just beginning. to read the whole story: click on: http://www.civilization.ca/academ/articles/durf1_1e.html ...............ahhh Yes Montreal ,was always interesting. wasn;t it
Here's the lyrics to Zoot Suit Riot,.......written by "Cherry Poppin Daddies" Who's that whisperin' in the trees?
It's two sailors and they're on leave
Pipes and chains and swingin' hands
Who's your daddy? Yes I am
Fat cat came to play
Now he can't run fast enough
You'd best stay away
When the pushers come to shove
Zoot suit riot
throw back a bottle of beer
Zoot suit riot
Pull a comb through your coal black hair
Zoot suit riot
throw back a bottle of beer
Zoot suit riot
Pull a comb through your coal black hair
Blow Daddy!
A whipped up jitterbuggin' brown eyed man
A stray cat frontin' up an eight-piece band
Cut me Sammy and you'll understand
In my veins hot music ran
You got me in a sway
and I want to swing you done
Now you sailors know
Where your women come for love
Zoot suit riot
Throw back a bottle of beer
Zoot suit riot
Pull a comb through your coal black hair
You're in a Zoot suit riot
You're in a Zoot suit riot
You're in a Zoot suit riot
(random gibberish)
Oh you got me in a sway
and I want to swing you done
Now you sailors know
Where your women come for love
Zoot suit riot
Throw back a bottle of beer
Zoot suit riot
Pull a comb through your coal black hair
Zoot suit riot
Throw back a bottle of beer
Zoot suit riot
Pull a comb through your coal black hair
You're in a Zoot suit riot
You're in a Zoot suit riot
You're in a Zoot suit riot
...................................................actually one of Our members who lives up near Tiny Tina ( I think) is in a band and they play Zoot Suit Riot, I will try to Remember which member and find his website:
interesting article
I'd just like to clarify what created the hostility between the armed forces and Zooters. The material used in the Zoot suits was needed in different war items such as parachutes. It was not outlawed but people had been asked not to use it. The Servicemen saw Zoot suits as a sign that the people wearing them didn't care for or support the men fighting for their freedom. In most cases it was true. The French who opposed the draft and scoffed at fighting for England as they put it. I knew one family whose older brothers came home from the war and found their younger brother wearing a Zoot. They hammered him and threw him out of the house. Servicemen felt it was a slap in the face. Ed
Ed...my father was French Canadian and volunteered for active duty over seas and ended up in a prisoner of war camp in Germany. He was in Stalag 357 in Follingbostel, Germany. Many of his friends had enlisted too and his regiment Les Fusliers Mont-Royal consisted of all French Canadians and many were killed during the Dieppe raid in august 1942. I visited the Canadian War Cemetary in France where my father's best friend Albert Fortin is buried, another French Canadian. This is the picture of the cemetery in Bretteville -sur- Laize on the Falaise/Caen road in Normany, France. The objective in Operation Totalize was to capture Falaise from the Germans so that the allied forces could continue on to Paris and to take the rest of France from the German Army. My father in the confusion along with a handful of other FMR's got separated from the main troop and were captured and taken prisoner. I have a lot of information regarding my father's wartime expieriences and one day hope to put all my notes and pictures into some sort of order. Dianne
Yes, Dianne, There were French Canadians in the military but the majority of resistors to the draft were French led by Montreal Mayor Houde, Lionel Groulx and others who claimed they would be fighting for England. They totally ignored the fact that France was occupied and England was trying to save it. Ed
Ed, You have a much better memory that I do. Bob Thompson's "Anticol" team sweaters when he played rugby and football for Verdun High, Bob was my first husband who went on to be a Captain for Air Canada and died of cancer at 44. I remember watching one of the games at the Boardwalk grounds, where I thought I was drawing my last breath as I was chocking on a sweet, someone has given me. Luckily for me I cleared it in time and no one around knew that I had been in fairly serious trouble. I would have certainly missed a lot in my life otherwise. Your sister Betty from Staffordshire, England.
Ed, I followed Bob thru VHS and Air Cadets and eventually worked with himinTCA/AC LATE 50S EARLY 60S
My husband also worked for Air Canada. He started his career at the downtown Res office, then went to Dorval. We moved to Halifax area in 1972 and he retired from Air Canada Sept. 1, 2001 after 36 years service. We belong to the Pionairs, a great group. My daughter Sarah works for Air Canada in Saint John, N.B. Dianne
My husband and I both worked for Air Canada at Dorval. We both left in December 65 when we moved to Peterborough. Barry worked in Airways Engineering and I worked in Quality Records....was sorry to leave and sure missed the passes. Still in contact with a few people who worked there and retired from Air Canada...it was a great place to work. Judy
From what some of our friends are saying, who weren't able to retire from AC, the place is not the same anymore. Dianne
That's to bad, things unfortunatley change, the same thing is true for Bell Canada now...but it to was a great place to work years ago. Judy
ahh yes! The Pav. What a fantastic place. It was so cool to be able to spend time with friends, listen to our 'tunes' and hopefully hook up with someone who made the heart beat a bit faster. Romance was always in the air. I hope no pictures of this eutopian palace are ever posted. I'm sure the reality of what it actually looked like through 'senior' eyes would be shattering. Some things are just better left in peace!!
daleb4, you have a very good point there! Some things are better left to our memories. On my last visit to Verdun one of my most cherished memories was tainted by the reality.
Well Maggiemck ,I think that's what they mean ,when they say "You can never go home again".............it';s not that you can't go there,...it's just that you can't go back to what you thought was there.......... but we can re-visit through Memories & Pictures & Stories,& Friends & of course Family,.....................that's what makes the 'Connection' and in this case a Verdun Connection,........and this is worth a lot ,to most who appreciae their past,.......but live in the present day & of course for the future:
The closest we've had so far of the old Pav,.............and I have to agree with daleb4 ,...if we had any clear & definitive shots of this old place,we may be disappointed,......but I would bet if we could contact one of the original owners somehow,they would certainly have some great shots from Inside ,the place,with it's creaky old wooden floors,......and maybe pics of the old Jukebox in the background,................I would like to see those for sure,.....and maybe even a shot of the Boardwalk side with the wooden shutter lifted from the window,..& maybe an old customer or two wandering out of the old place with a bag of fries,................ I would have to agree ,just a shot of the wooden building it really was ,may be a bit of a let down,.....but it certainly couldn't block the old memories: (at least I'd hope it wouldn't)............but I will still keep an eye out for those elusive photo's................. Here's a picture from Margo's Photo Album, thanks mags
Joey, the pictures you attached (of "the Pav") to message # 16 in this thread do not load. Can you re-post them?
..,,,,,, These are the 3 attachments that joey had in msg #16 of this thread, Although titled Pav,.it was referring to a very old building called the Pavillion,.... ps: Maggie I found that these pics did open,but only after Iwent to close out again ,after them not opening initilally.........
I was getting a message that said there was an error. Now it opens. Just enough to keep me mildly confused....a continuous state of mind for me. I believe there is a difference in opinion here about what or where exactly the "PAV" is/was. As a neutral outsider (didn't know the place existed until the topic came up here) I'm going to suggest that we try to establish what and where it is/was to each generation. In one of Joey's attachments, it is suggested that the "pavillion" existed BEFORE Verdun did. (1874) and that there might have been one recognized by the french and another for the English. Please try to identify the decade that relates to what and where you are referring to. This seems to be a bigger mystery than the "Spy" that lived in Verdun! Let's start here!
Hi Maggie,....it doesn't seem to be much of a mystery to me,In almost every mention of what I refer to as the Pav,....most people have also mentioned Cement Downs,............seems simple the Pav,(taht most od us kids were warned against hanging around) id quite Simply Woodland & Lasalle Blvd a Wooden building that was attached to the old Verdun Tennis Club,these buildings were fixed in place & to my knowlerdge didn't migrgate to different areas of the city..............hahahahahah Woodland is what I am referring to,right beside the Bandshell,not far from the Redtop,up the street from Woodland Restaurant ,.steps from Transfer Park,............At leas that is the only one ,that was a hangout for kids in the 50's & 60's(shut down for good roughly around 1968,.when the owners tired of constant break-ins and the jukebox being robbed, Along that fence on the left which encloses the tennis courts,...their is a building a little further down,you can see the roof etc etc ...and further down the boardwalk you can make out the roofline of the old 'Redtop'..btwn that redtop & the building at the end of the Tennis Club,..was the Pav (the only Pav,near Cement Downs,.......... I think the name Pavillion is used to describe certain buildings ,and I think even the Douglas called some of their buildings Pavillions,......... but ,this one at Woodland is pretty much the one that almost all would recognise more readily,from those years I mentioned 50's & 60's pretty much the only Hangout , .......and this was the spot ,that had this large Cement area in front of the old Bandshell ,.....that's where all these kids are dancing (btwn the 'Redtop on the left,......and the Bandshell with the 'Pav' behind it on the boardwalk,over to the right of this photo...................That's the 'Pav' I am referring to. Sure wish I had a definitve picture of it.............hahahahahah
Wasn't there also Lawn Bowling ,as well as the Tennis Courts,?? ........................................................
Les, There was a Lawn Bowling Club on the boardwalk side of Lasalle between Riverview and Godin in the 50's Ruth
Yes Thank Ruth ,that's what I was thinking of,.........and in the topic of "old photo's of the boardwalk " RC Dave posted an aerial map of the area,....showing the Redtop near the old Torchy Wharf,..and in the same map you can make out the Lawn Bowling Park,that your speaking of: That's what I like about this site,People help out ,from all sides,...Thanjs Here's the map " just like being Home Again isn't it?............Notice how much land has been reclaimed by the City for use as a nice Greenspace,.................the whole Island of Montreal is to be commended for their efforts in cleaning up the River ,the Canal,.and the back River,too.............there's pedestrian/cyclist paths all over now...........................
Maggie, The dictionary describes a pavillion as a 'light ornamental, roofed structure usually used for picnic or entertainment.' It is the same in French. A pavillion can be put up anywhere. I remember the 'pav' in the picture above at Church and LaSalle. My Mother used to take us for walks from Woodland down the boardwalk to that Pavillion which I seem to remember had a 'Chevalier de Clombe' sign in front. We used to buy ice cream there. I liked the big gallery which reminded me of my Grandfathers house in Moncton. I don't remember much of the Woodland Pavillion because the girl I eventually married was from the point and we used to dance at the old '79th Battery Armory which later became the Point Boys Club. I remember the room in the armory where you bought your beer was called the pavillion. One of my reasons for going there. They didn't ask your age. Ed
Incidentally, the 'Pavillion" at Church and LaSallle was there before Verdun. It is the one where the founding Fathers met. I remember Mayor Wilson telling us that when he was guest speaker at our Boy Scouts father and son Banquet. Ed
thought the pav was at woodland and wellington
john
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better read back in the messag line JOHNMELIVIN2.
I can remember going to the PAV when I was 6 yrs old and the Verdun Yacht Club giving out trophies to my father and others inside the Pav for the boat races they had then and years after...... Now that was 54 yrs ago. I also hung around the Pav from 1959 till I was 21 in 1967. So did my husband. Only he belonged to the Verdun Yacht Club right below and down ALL those stairs. That was before the city moved the VYC down to Demarchais Blvd and Lasalle Blvd. I have alot of fond memeories about the Pav. Use to go to the dances they had in front of the Bandshell and also skating in the winter. I will look through the old photos my father had and see if I can find some of the Pav. I think that I have a picture of the Boardwalk when it was wood. I think that it was just labelled the PAV for lack of a better word. The City of Verdun owned the building originally and leased it out. They had leased apart of it to the Verdun Yacht Club way back and up to 68/69 if my memory serves me right. We used the part next door to the Pav for the boating club in 1967/68. Not sure what happened after that. Harriett
This message has been deleted by the author.
Les and Maggi ....
Excuse me for takeing so long to reply....I've been very busy.
I've tried ten times to upload pictures and also a file attempt, this will be my last attempt tonight .
If there are any objections to my file I will immediately cease the activity ....
Hope that it gives some people some enjoyment .
joey
OMG......well done joey-verdun.......WOW bring on some more. We can never see enough. Hail, hail, well done young fellow. Cheers.
That book of yours will be well read,I'm sure ,Looks like you have quite a collection of Verdun info & stories joey,......Good Luck ,with that project,I'm certain ,it will be on Our Number One Best Sellers list..............................Looks Interesting so far
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